Podcast: Get Your Marriage On with Dan Purcell
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Below is the unedited transcription of the podcast. Link to Dan Purcell and the Get Your Marriage On.
Lantz Howard 0:01
Welcome to another episode of champion hope. I’m your host Lantz, Howard Man, I am so glad and honored that you have decided to stop by for another episode. This week I have a friend on and guest on Dan Purcell. But before I jump into that episode, be sure to go back and listen to last week’s episode with Garrett, Uncle Bach. Garrett, Uncle Bach was a former Navy SEAL, an outstanding man of God, and tons of valuable insight that others have shared with me and said, thanks for having Garrett on the podcast. So go back, check out that episode.
Dan Purcell 4:15
My wife and I were we met in middle school. We didn’t date seriously in middle school or high school but we’re always in the same circle of friends. And we went to different universities after high school and one summer between our junior inns. See our sophomore and junior year we had both come home for the summer because our summer plans my summer plans fell through like internship fell through study abroad fell through everything fell through and it was
Lantz Howard 0:41
For today. Dan Purcell is an app developer, but specifically, he’s taken his expertise as an engineer to help Christian men, marriages and service in a new capacity, you can check him out and get your marriage on and find his app or apps primarily, intimately, us, I will link to the show notes. All that being said, Dan and his wife have led the way in creating valuable resources that you can find at get your marriage on. And like I said, the intimately us app that you can find on your app platform. We dive deep into why nice guys don’t get what they want in the bedroom, how to be self differentiated, and speak up for your desires, needs and wants in the bedroom. And just basically how you can continue to grow in your sexuality, embrace it, allow trust and safety, to be a common denominator in your marriage, to continue to explore bonding and growing closer together, primarily in this conversation through sexual intimacy with your spouse. So may you have the courage to listen to this episode, find what’s useful, apply it and share it with your spouse as well. And if you have the courage as well to share this episode with a friend, thanks for tuning in. And before I run and leave you with the episode, this month over at the champions circle, we have been exploring marriage and what it means to have a strong marriage. The champion circle is a group of like-minded men who are setting out to conquer the growth we desire to achieve. The specific topic this month has been married last month was identity. So check out the champion circle. And if you’re looking for a place to grow, we would be honored to have you join us at the table. Look forward to seeing you on the inside of the champion circle. And once again, you can find everything you need at champion hope.com. And remember that champions on the outside are built with hope on the inside. Without further ado, here is the episode with Dan Purcell. And you can find all the links in the show notes today. Absolutely, absolutely. Cool. Sir Dan, I am honored to have you today on the champion hope podcast. And as a way of getting started. I’m always intrigued by people’s lack of better word origin story. You have get your marriage on.com yet have several different apps, namely the intimately submit the US us app, which you can find on your app store. And we’ll talk about that. But what’s your what’s your origin story? Your heartbeat as a creator, entrepreneur, engineer, father, husband, all the roles you play What’s the story?
Dan Purcell 4:06
on the on the enneagram I’m a seven. I like to have fun. And that will like really paint the picture of my story.
discouraging have to come home and my wife, same story for her like she was home and we met at church on Sunday. The first Sunday back and it was we hadn’t seen each other for years, but it was so great. refreshing to like, find a friend, because here I was at home thinking, I don’t have any friends. And she’s home thinking, I don’t have any friends. And so it’s like, we hit it off as if we haven’t skipped a beat. And we just spent everyday that summer together, just hanging out, just goofing off and having fun. And then that friendship really started to blossom. And by the end of summer, we were engaged to be married. And so we’ve, we’ve felt, I guess you could say we’ve had a fairly good marriage, about 30, after our 30th anniversary, I had a conversation with a friend. And that friend really opened up about his sex life to me, and I don’t know about you, but that just wasn’t a really common conversation I have with my friends, usually, those we don’t talk about sex openly, or it’s kind of a taboo topic. But he was so sincere because he was telling me about how he wanted to take better care of his wife in bed and found these like Christian friendly, like helpful resources that are out there. And their sex life is taken off, and they’re getting along better than they ever have. And they’re no good along with their kids better. And just everything else in life seems to like go better. When your love life is going better, too. And so he’s telling me these things, and I’m blushing through the whole conversation. I can’t believe someone is like, talking to me about this. So I, I, I go home, and I tell my wife, like you’d never guess what kind of conversation I had today. I think about one summer between our sophomore and senior year, sophomore in junior year in college, I, all my summer plans fell through my internship fell through, study abroad fell through and out of default, I came home and I wasn’t happy about coming home because I didn’t think I’d have any friends back at home. And my wife had a similar thing happened to her all her summer plans fell through. So she comes home. And we met each other up at church the first the next Sunday. And it was so refreshing to have a friend they’re like, it’s so great to have a familiar face. And we we kicked it off, like we had never missed a beat from from back in the high school days. And it’s just that we saw each other that every day, that whole summer. And by the end summer, we were engaged. And fast forward.
Several years, we’ve had a fairly good marriage, just like any other marriage, we have our ups and downs. We’ve had, you know, financial difficulties we’ve had, you know, you know, just struggles that are normal. And we have a very normal marriage, we disagree on many things. And we agree on many things. And we’ve learned to work together. But overall, we’ve had we have a fairly good relationship one day. This is about four years ago talking to a friend who really opened up about his sex life. And I was blushing the whole time for this conversation because I’d normally don’t have conversations with other people, or they really open up about like their own sex life. But he was so sincere he is talking about Christian friendly resources they just found online and in books that kind of help him and his wife connect better sexually. And as a result, the quality of their sex life has improved. And I was really self conscious from that conversation a because as uncomfortable and be I was uncomfortable that I was uncomfortable. Like I shouldn’t be above this, I should totally be okay with this. But why am I so embarrassed to have such a conversation? And it realized I had a lot of growing to do. I had a lot of insecurities in this area. Because I don’t know, I don’t Google my sex questions, I kind of am so afraid of what I’m going to run into or see. And you get the message over and over and you see it to how like pornography. This like people who misuse pornography can really like it causes damage to the marriage. And I did not want to be one of those people that was really important to me and my values. But my friend is so sincere, there’s like, much more out there to learn. And so I go home to my wife and say, Hey, you’d never guess the kind of conversation I had today with with my friend like, what do you think? How are we doing? What are your thoughts about these things? And, and that was probably the first time in our marriage that point we had a really deep conversation about our intimate life and about how we feel about certain things and topics and really getting really vulnerable. Like, do you like What’s it like being married to me in this way? And do you like x, y and z? Or would you like to try a B and C and really like having this like conversation about about our own sex life? It was really scary and really vulnerable and it happened night after night. Now you know it for the next Few weeks, up to no night because whether all these onion layers to peel back. And so we had this. And one thing we concluded is we both had a lot more we want to learn. So we decided we’d buy some books, we found a great author who’s a base, we decided to read books together, we found some really helpful books by Christian authors. And one of the books is called like the good girls guide to great sex by Sheila Ray Gregoire, loved her stuff. And then we read the second book third, but I think within a year, we read both books together, and we found podcasts and blogs and, and but the greatest thing is our own marriage started to really transform, it really started to take off. And we’re we were closer than we’ve ever been. And we’re having more fun than we ever have been, and just just the bond between us, but got a lot stronger. And all of a sudden, my marriage vows and Covenants kind of took on a whole new meaning than they ever have before. And it’s not just that, but the way we parent, our kids changed, because now that my wife and I feel more secure in our relationship. We’re it’s we’re more of a team now parenting our kids. And so a lot of areas, a lot of the important areas in our life kind of took on new meaning, and the lesser important parts of our life kind of faded into the background kind of became less important through that whole process.
Lantz Howard 11:29
So when we started this, you said that your desired goal would be able to give men some courage and men some hope, in terms of their relationships in the context of their marriage. And having a man do that for you. Right, that was wholehearted enough to show up and have what we’d consider a vulnerable and authentic conversation. Yeah. ignited. You didn’t say this. But it ignited our growth season, which inevitably, there’s probably some conflict, some confusion, some lots of that. Some doubt, right. And just as you expressed like that first time going home, asking those questions. Yes. What if? Could we do? Have you ever thought about it? So I hope we can do the same thing through explored a few things. And it’s interesting as a what you said in enneagram? Seven? Right. The desire to be in the moment sexually with your wife, is going to be something totally different from an enneagram nine, right? So intimacy and language with our spouses are going to mean something different. Because for you, it’s always about the new the next, the better, was that good enough type of thing? In for myself, I avoid the conflict of like, what, you know, maybe we should try a different way? Or do this or that, if that makes sense. So let’s let’s go there for a moment. As, as men, and maybe if you want to speak on the inia gram language, since it’s familiar to a lot of our audience. What is what is keeping men from having that first initial conversation? For you? It might have came easy, right? Like, Hey,
Dan Purcell 13:28
no, it doesn’t come easy. And I don’t know of anyone that would say, Oh, yeah, that was really easy for me.
Lantz Howard 13:34
So even as an enneagram, seven, there was still some resistance of like, this new, exciting adventure that you’re about to go on. Part. Yeah,
Dan Purcell 13:42
part of it’s because there’s part of growing up as, as men or as individuals, is what I like this term from Dr. David snart, he calls it a reflected sense of self, versus a solid sense of self. And what that means is a lot of our life growing up, we get our sense of self based on what others around us are telling us. And that’s normal. And that’s good. Because when you’re a child, you have no real sense of self. So you get a lot of it from your parents, and from school and from friends. And even when you’re newlywed in your marriage, you care very much about the way your spouse thinks of you. And that’s, that’s part of human growth and development. That’s, that’s, that’s normal. But that’s like more of the beginning phase. So having vulnerable conversation is scary, because if they have a different opinion than you do, what does that mean about me? Like, what does that mean about us? So that’s like, part of that wanting to avoid conflict is another way of saying it, but it’s really is this like, your sense of value of who you are, to some degree or another is dependent on what you think about someone else. matters a lot to you, but they think of you. So if your wife matters a lot to you, you’re going to care a lot about her opinion on something. So when your opinion differs, it’s it’s going to be, it’s going to hurt. But the process through that, and as you grow and mature, and I’m talking about marriages that have been married for 3540 5045 50 years, generally have much better, more exciting, more meaningful, sexual experiences together, deeper intimacy, because they’ve matured so much through that, like, the kind of sex they can enjoy is nothing compared to 20 year old newlyweds, even though their bodies might function. Well, it’s just the emotional side just doesn’t compare doesn’t even come close. So so. So part of that is like learning how to become solid in yourself. And holding on to some core values, what you believe is important, even in the face of an invalidation. And that’s why talking about sex is so hard because it can get invalidated. And you need to like, decide, am I gonna stick true to what I think is right? And what is good, and to the best with within, you know? Even if it doesn’t go very well. And most of the time, what do you want to bring up to your spouse, hey, I’m gonna try something new. Nine times out of 10, it doesn’t go well.
Lantz Howard 16:25
Since you just kind of left that nugget, what what’s a better phrase, or a possible better way to articulate even just what you said they’re,
Dan Purcell 16:35
like, in the derby, like an example of wanting to bring up something you have to try? And that Yeah, my tip number one would be to always put it in your own, like self referencing frame, like, I want to try this, I think this is, it’s coming from a place of advocacy, like you’re advocating for what’s good for the marriage. So I think it would be great for us, if this were the case, we should, I think it’d be great if we had sex more frequently. Or if we, you know, you know, fill in the blank, whatever it might be, that’s on your bucket list of what you want, right? That you’ve always been so scared to share. But when it comes from, like, a place of like, because you’re solid within yourself, or like the opposite struggle, I can see how it would be really hard to be married to me in these situations. And we can be really raw and vulnerable, and kind of see yourself in front of your spouse. That’s also another great leap forward in your growth and development.
Lantz Howard 17:45
You mentioned, to a large degree in the last several minutes, what you’re talking about, is this idea of self differentiation. And you didn’t say the book but the passionate marriage book, yes, by David snarf. How would you say his last name? And this is such a difficult topic for men? Whether you’re 25 or 55? I hear it I experience it all the time. What are what are ways in which men experience this growing up? Right? Because it’s easy for us to turn this conversation into a sexual conversation about intimacy with our wife. But the reality is, is what I’ve experienced, and those that I serve, is that really, the conversation is about 90% of what you can do and own. Yes. But we’re not willing to go there and do that hard work. We think it’s always about the other person. So
Dan Purcell 18:48
and your wouldn’t be so easy if everyone else changed to accommodate me all the time. Oh, that’d be so nice.
Lantz Howard 18:57
So in your experience, talking about some of those values, other people may know this as as like the nice guy syndrome, especially for for guys that are following the way of Jesus. We think that having strong positions, or clear positions on values and meaning and intimacy, we don’t feel like they’re valid because of a lot of what I would say toxic Christian spirituality, that we haven’t defined sexuality in a good way. And we haven’t really defined ourselves in a good way. So all that to say, how does a man begin to become integrated as a whole person himself based on your experience?
Dan Purcell 19:45
The first step is to affirm positive male sexuality. and own it don’t apologize for being a sexual being. With our family. We went to the San Diego Zoo a few summers ago. Awesome zoo. It’s not only a zoo for animals, but they have exotic plants from all over the world too. And I just couldn’t get over the variety of God’s creations. Like, there’s so much variety, like God loves creation, and he loves it. And for whatever isn’t I kind of internalize that message for me that he is so pro creativity and so pro this like life giving part of the, of his creations. And for me, that’s my sexuality, that’s a great way for me to express creativity. It’s how I can express deep and like love, and commitment, it’s a way that we can be benevolent. It’s a way I can, like nurture. And, and it’s, it’s also life giving to me, and not just for like making children but like life giving, as it puts a bounce in my step like it makes like, it’s, it’s a makes life worth living to have a great sex life. So. But all the men I talked to have a really hard time with thinking positively about their own sexuality. And it could be because of the teachings and whoever is teaching them probably also had a hard time with their own sexuality. So when your own, when you’re very insecure, you’re going to have a hard time telling people that it’s great. So it’s a lot easier to swing the conversation on the like the dangers and Miss of business using your sexuality, because that’s safer and easier place to kind of come from, rather than the positive side, if you don’t affirm it yourself.
Lantz Howard 21:42
That’s good. That’s good. So your origin story is similar to mine, when my wife and I’ve been married. It’s coming up on 17 years, at the end of this year. And early on, we we struggled through sexual intimacy, much of what you’re describing, when we were in a marriage and family therapist office, within 18 months, two years of marriage, just trying to figure out like, we thought, sex and intimacy was gonna be this. But because of things that have happened in her life, in my life, we’re like, we’re not on the same page, you know. But there’s a lot of growing up, and all of that. And as you said, 17 years in this, I’m like, Man, this is mind blowing how amazing sexual intimacy can be, and, and what becomes possible when you start owning your own growth and development. But for those that, before we started recording, we were talking about like, a lot of men aren’t willing to one, go to a therapist to see a coach three, maybe they don’t have the man in their life that is full of courage to kind of open up the box. How do you help that man who is a business leader, that’s possibly living in isolation. But he knows that there’s more like, right, there’s that sense of hunger, that he knows that there’s more like, how do you begin to guide that man, on on his journey?
Dan Purcell 23:20
individuals are really complex. And there’s a lot of complexities going on. As far as what’s keeping them back. It could be just work stress, as entrepreneurs, my head, you know, you and I can relate to this, our heads are always buzzing with like, work and business ideas, it just never ends. Then there’s, you know, you know, just life pressures. And there’s expectations, and what will others think of me, and there’s, there’s all of those things, too, that I think are valid barriers. One helpful thing I would recommend is to kind of do whatever you can to slow things down. I like to I like journal. And to me journaling is, I find a quiet place. And I just without a filter, I just dump my whatever’s in my head as fast as I can on paper. I don’t care about grammar or spelling or anything. It’s It’s my way of just like dumping, brain dump or thought download whatever you call it. That can usually help you kind of sort through why you have a hang up over going to counseling. What is it about counseling that you don’t like? What is it put on paper, put it out there without any judgment. And then if you want to pick it up, and now read it back to yourself with more now using your thinking brain, you’ve got your emotional side all like out on paper. Now you can kind of deconstruct and then you can reconstruct. Another thing I’d recommend is realize like what’s the harm? Like what’s what’s the worst case scenario out Worst case scenario that’ll happen from this. But what’s more of a reasonable worst case scenario that happened from this, we tend to live in like an either or type of thinking, it’s either going to be absolutely horrible or great, but most experiences are going to be somewhere in the middle. So recognize that you kind of be a little more realistic about that. And if you don’t like your therapist, you don’t have to go back find a different one. Like, there are varying degrees of therapists out there, just as there are varying degrees of lawyers, varying degrees of carpenters, varying degrees of software developers and skill, right. So find a good one that you think if they don’t work out, or what they’re saying doesn’t resonate with you look for a better one. Most therapists became therapists for my experience, because they had their own issues, they wanted to find answers to, so they went to school to study them. So they could like not only help themselves, but like help others along the way. So usually, therapists are pretty experienced, and they’re very used to working with people that are uncomfortable with being in a therapist office, that’s their job. So and the very best therapists I think, are going to like, if it’s your wife, who’s more want to go therapy than you do. They’re good therapists are going to work more on the wife than you. Because if you want to create change in any relationship, you’re going to start with the one with the higher desire first, because that’s how good therapy works. Marriage is a system. And if you want to fix the system, you’re going to work with the one that’s a little more motivated to fix the system. Because once that one’s fixed, both people are the experience for both people improve. So a lot of people are afraid to go therapist because he’s already going to tell me or she’s already going to tell me stuff I already know that I need to work on that I don’t want to do. And generally, that’s not going to be the case. So just recognizing that. And you’d go to a doctor, if you had a health problem. If you had a broken leg, I hope you’d go to a doctor get get that worked on. Or if you had a really bad toothache, you’d go to a dentist, and it said, average people that end up deciding to go to marriage therapy had been dealing with an issue for six years, on average before they went and got help. So the six years of their life lost that they could have fixed and reclaimed and could have enjoyed that much more happiness. So go for it.
Lantz Howard 27:28
So you’re pulling back the curtain on why you’re serving and doing what you’re doing. Yeah. Like myself as well, right. I think of the the book in renown, or, you know, the wounded healer is that is that our best work comes from our best place of brokenness once God does his transforming work in us and through us. If we’re willing to be receptive to that work. And I like what you said about journaling. I have a client right now that I’m serving almost to the same practice that you’re talking about just to get his thoughts out. Just to get his emotions he he’s an enneagram. Seven as well. And he’s he’s trying to figure out how does he experience just himself, right? Do a lot of breathing with my clients as well. Like just like, slow down. Like there’s just so much anxiety and noise going on in our world. It’s hard to slow down, as you mentioned. What let’s move into some very practical like, maybe it’s just some golden nuggets of, you know, bite sized pieces. I’m thinking about the concept that all of marriage is foreplay. Like everything that we do is foreplay. Like foreplay doesn’t happen when you get to the bedroom. It’s everyday it’s from the laundry to the dishes. It’s a text messages. I’m trying to I try to be intentional with sending my wife throughout the week. What are those things that you find helpful or possibly, you know, that other people are doing that are helpful? If it is true that all of marriage is foreplay.
Dan Purcell 29:10
I like that. And I hear that all the time, like the way like it’s all foreplay everything you do. But I really had a hard time grasping that until someone helped me realize that the way you do sex is a like, it’s a type. It’s it’s like a representation of the way you do life. And the way you’re doing life is a representation of the way you do sex. Once someone pointed out to me like holy cow, you’re absolutely right. So, Corey Allen. Corey Allen Yeah. Dr. coriell good friend of mine. Yes. I love how he makes that so clear. So when, when the way I do life is the way sex is going to be. To me it means so back to the foreplay thing. The when This is also James clear quote, We don’t rise to the level of aspirations and slobbering the code, we just, we fall to the level of our systems, like, you’re only as good as the like the floor, you’re not, not the ceiling, so to speak. So the idea is, can you build a life together? And just by leveling up, even if it’s a 1% improvement each day, how can I raise my floor so that my wife, I’m a great choice for her, I’m a fantastic option for her. Like, this is something that she would like, giving her great reasons why she should desire me. And that could be because they’re willing to help out around the house, if that’s important. It might be because you’re going to be really patient with their children. It might be because you’re thoughtful, and send that text message, whatever it is, you’re reinforcing this idea that, um, a good choice. Of course, you’re not being egotistical as you say that but like, we’re not like guest on and Buting the beast as we do that, but like, like, but you’re, you’re going to create a cultivate a site, preparing a garden, that that’s great soil so that things can grow, you’re going to cultivate a great relationship so that you’re a great option.
Lantz Howard 31:19
So if I was gonna put my coaching hat on for a moment, what are what are those 1% things that Dan is currently doing?
Dan Purcell 31:29
Great question, I sound cheesy, I printed out a little chart for myself, like a daily chart, like to tick things off. And I’ve come up with, like, 1014 things or so that are on it, things that I know I need to work on. And so every day, I put it on my bathroom counter next to like, when I brush my teeth, I see it. So that’s when I like need to mark it off. And I it’s like, it’s like things I’m working on. And so it’s kind of front and center and kind of helps me kind of stay accountable to myself or things I know, for sure, sure those things are gonna really personal, aren’t we? There’s, there’s a variety of smattering of things. One is expressing gratitude to God, did I do that today? Okay. I want to so one thing I’m doing spiritually, is spending time in the word. So my personal goal is to spend 20 minutes of uninterrupted like, good, effective time. So I have on there a box, how many minutes did you spend today and the word and so I, my goal is a minimum of 20 minutes a day. So like, like, for example, that’s one thing on there. I want to daily push ups is something else I’m trying to do to build physically, physically, physically. So I have a box in there, how many pushups to do today. And another tendency I tend to have is I don’t seek first to understand, then be understood, I don’t follow that very well. I’m very, very good at like, making my point known, but like really taking and listening to what the other person is saying the meaning behind things is something I constantly need to work on. So that’s a box I have on there to how well did I do today at listening to others without judgment. I’m trying to think of other things that are on there, but it and it kind of varies week to week, like sometimes, like, you know, I’ve been pretty good at this verse, I’ve had a really good streak at this, I don’t need to take up space on my chart anymore for that. Instead, there’s other thing I really need to work on. So I’m going to add that to my list instead. And working on that.
Lantz Howard 33:51
It’s good. I love that. I love that I have a just over to my left, daily dozen from john Maxwell that, uh, that I have had, man, almost as long as I’ve been married 1516 years now that similar thought, right? What are these things that I’m cultivating and growing as a person? And how am I accountable to those things? To check those each day? I love it. So let’s let’s dive into maybe some pragmatics around the app, the intimately us app, you can find it where wherever you download your app, obviously. You keep developing it and adding new content to that. I think downloaded How long has it been out by the way, a year now. Okay, so maybe downloaded it pretty early on. Awesome. I don’t even know how I found it to be honest with you. But kudos to you and what you’re producing and putting out who who’s who’s the brainchild besides the engineering part of it. Like what’s going on behind the scenes? To create all the beautiful content
Dan Purcell 35:02
that is there, a lot of it’s my wife and I. Okay. And yeah. And and I also have a team that helps with that by team. So we get on slack and we like, All right, go. And without a filter, we just brainstorm ideas and whatever. So there’s there’s that aspect going on too. Is that your question? Like, on the creation side?
Lantz Howard 35:29
Yeah, yeah, I mean, cuz I keep my for everybody listening one download the app, but to the app is, is keeps growing. I mean, I keep saying new games and new articles. Of course, the podcast that you’re doing and host on are on there. But I’m just really intrigued by some of the development, the articles, I mean, even maybe, maybe sure shared, let’s do this share one of your most intriguing curious ones. Maybe it’s the game, maybe it’s an article, something that you’ve recently worked on that you’re like, proud that it’s in the app,
Dan Purcell 36:06
like, oh, there’s so much. It’s not an article, it’s not a game. But the thing I’m most proud of is the daily intimacy challenge. On the home screen of the app every day, it’ll prompt you, it gives you a suggestion to usually take about five minutes or less of something can do to help build your marriage that day. And I don’t, it’s okay if you don’t do it. But the idea that it’s front of mind and conscious that today, I’m going to choose to do one thing. That’s even if it’s small, to help build and improve my relationship with my wife. Because I believe great marriages are built over a series of little things done consistently. Then grandiose, like big, expensive things done sporadically. So it’s that daily intimacy thing. But as far as articles go, the most popular articles in the app are the are the technique and how to articles like how do I give my husband a good hand job? How do I manually stimulate my wife, how do I, and so on, and so on. So I think those are most popular. Those are, we’ve written them. But we’ve also have, you know, friends that are marriage family therapist, certified sex therapists, that can also look at it with more like a scientific lens to to make sure it’s accurate. But we also understand our audience is a Christian friendly audience. So we’re not going to make it really crass or raunchy, either. So it’s accurate. It’s to the point, it’s very blunt. But it’s also not going to be gross or weird. So that’s our approach.
Lantz Howard 37:47
That’s good. Yeah. While you were talking, I was like, What is what was the tip for the day it is to leave a mint or chocolate on the pillow? So yeah, I mean, there’s, there’s just a wealth. I mean, I can’t even go into all the creativity and energy that you guys have put into it. So just really hats off. And if you’re listening, download it. It’s been a wealth of information. A couple of questions. One from our client currently serving and I think these are valid questions for every person, because I think they’re just really real. There’s so much tension, anxiety, that resides in marriages around sexual intimacy, that how to use the techniques or new positions. And on the list goes. So so here’s here’s a couple questions. How to start having the sex live conversations when you haven’t been very good at it? Can you become too organized around making sex the topic like? Because for men, right? And sometimes our wives interpret, like all you’ll ever want to talk about is sex. While all our wives ever want to talk about is emotional intimacy, so can you talk about it too much? And where’s the happy medium? So? Start off on that for a moment.
Dan Purcell 39:18
Okay. The first question is, how do you talk about it? If that hasn’t been your normal conversation? Right? I would begin with the meta conversation first and say it This might be really scary to say, but say, you can wait some time. Talk about sex, talk about our sexual relationship. And they might feel really defensive like whoa, what do you mean, it’s not good enough? Or, Oh, are you gonna confess something? It’s like, No, no, no. We can talk about now if you want, but I just want to talk more about this because it’s something I think we need to talk more about, and it’s all good. Like, if you can kind of frame that you want to talk about it. And it be, but whatever you do be perfectly honest, you’re not trying to beat around the bush, you want to be direct, right? Because it sends a wrong message when you’re like, it would be great if we talked about sex war, and you kind of left it hanging in the air like that. That doesn’t do any. That doesn’t help at all. So be direct. Like, I would like to get better at this because I can always frame it in, like a self referencing frame. Yeah, like, I have a hard time talking about sex with you. I need to get better at this. Will you please help me? Can we talk about this sometime?
Lantz Howard 40:37
Well, and then and then even finishing that off with just saying, hey, some time and get specific saying like, my wife and I we made on Sunday nights for an hour for pay on Sunday night? Can we talk about a little bit more? Yes, versus just leaving it hanging? Because I think what you’re saying is that, just get it out in the open, be direct about it. And allow that anxiety of the system, just to kind of back off, allow everybody to think have some heart space and headspace around it. But you know, the end date of like, oh, we’re gonna have the conversation.
Dan Purcell 41:12
Yes, yeah, that helps a lot. And that might also work for finances and work with parenting in laws, other major parts of your marriage, too. But another thing that I found from my experience, and helped others is to put things that kind of in a container, like, if if it was like, if we’re going to talk about tonight, and it’s, this is like a practice conversation. I’m making a kind of making light of the situation. But like, if you kind of approach it, like, what would it be like, if we were to have a conversation about sex, it kind of makes things a little more like, you can get curious and open and without getting too personally invested? And like hurt if things don’t go? Because you’re now understanding like, Oh, yeah, it would be hard to have a conversation because we haven’t had a conversation before or I do too much assuming or we do too much mind reading and too much mind mapping in our marriage, like, we need to kind of, that’s why it’s hard. So you can have like a meta conversation about it too, if that’s hard. But whatever you do, don’t shy away from it and be direct and own it and, and have that conversation. The longer you prolong it, the harder it gets. And it’s like a lot of sight. For some people like going to the gym is a hard thing. They drag themselves out of bed. But by the time they get there, and they’re actually like doing the weightlifting or the treadmill, whatever it is, you’re like, I’m so glad I’m here. I’m so glad I did it right. And you go home like I did it. I’m a champ, right? I think conversations about sex and feel that way too. Like, you’re not looking forward to that. But once you’re having a conversation, it’s over. It’s like I did it, we did it. We’re a champ. So there’s that aspect as well. And recognize that it’s not going to succeed all the time. Sometimes it’s gonna be really uncomfortable. And that’s okay. And that’s just life. And that’s normal. So,
Lantz Howard 43:14
and it’s not a one and done conversation. Oh, no, no, no. Yeah, I mean, that’s that. And working with guys. Right, going back to the fitness analogy, it’s, it’s like the realization that you don’t lose 30 pounds. By eating doughnuts every single day, like you got to still keep choosing to eat the salad. Right or eat the chicken, you got to keep choosing to have all the nuggets of laundry and dishes and foreplay and keep bringing the sexual intimacy up. So don’t think that the magic wand is going to appear in one conversation. Because even for myself, I can look back even just in the last five or six year my mind is blown about our own personal growth and transformation. But that’s because my wife and I are very growth minded in what we choose to do in all of life. Yes. So So can you talk about it too much one from from a male perspective. Can you talk about it too much? And two, from typically major papers, but typically the lower desire wife. She doesn’t want to talk about it as much. So can you talk about it too much?
Dan Purcell 44:30
No, I don’t. What’s there not to like about such a conversation? Why? Why would there be anything else you’d want to talk about? Yeah, yeah, you could, like, you know, you gotta keep things within balance in life. You got you can’t just be so fixated on one topic. That’s all you talk about. You got to live life fully and be a well rounded person. There are couples where like she loves like Dave Ramsey. For instance, I’m well listen to everything Dave Ramsey says I read all the books and she loves. That’s what she wants to talk about all the time. And he doesn’t. Or he’s really into, I don’t know, sports, and she doesn’t want to hear it either. So sex is No, I don’t think that far different from like, yeah, you just really into learning more about growing sexually, while someone else might be really into and grown financially or physically or in other areas, too. So I think putting that in perspective kind of helps. If it is something that you do want to talk about, more than than she does, dig deep and find out why is it because of like some unmet need still that you’re skirting around? And you’re not getting to? Is it like coming out of insecurity? Or is it really a genuine interest, and you think it’s great, and a wonderful part of being a human and your experience, and whatever it is, dig deep to find out what your best and highest values are, and don’t apologize for it. Like, if it’s exciting to you, and great, and something that you want to keep, like, progressing on and working together on and discussing together, that’d be great. I also don’t think it’s very nice. If it’s like a conversation, where it’s always like you directed, it’s like a dentist drilling on your tooth, they keep drilling on my tooth over and over, like quit that I don’t want to always be drilled on my tooth, every time I see you, Mr. dentist, like, you don’t want to be that you don’t want to be that kind of a husband either where they, your wife constantly feels like she’s getting drilled on and pointed out. So that’s not kind either. So I’d say keep things in balance, and read the cues and just be a good friend. First. Be a good, like, life partner first. And then from on top of that build on your your sex conversations. That’s good.
Lantz Howard 46:53
Thank you, Dan, for for time, energy effort. Every person listening needs to get your app intimately, us and thank you for the wealth of information and tools and articles that you’re providing to, you know, by and large, a Christian environment, a safe environment to explore this topic or so, so needed. So thank you to that. May you keep up the good work, for sure. just in closing, if I was to fast forward, say, say in 90 days, from our conversation today. What would you what is it that Dan wants in his marriage? Like what is it like Dan is pursuing right now and in his marriage in 90 days, it’s going to be worth the energy and effort.
Dan Purcell 47:59
I hope you edit out the long pause. Think of this one on a give a genuine answer.
But that’s don’t end on a downer note on an upbeat note. Okay, I’m going to attempt an answer. If it’s bad, we’ll like scratch it and try another one. How’s that? Go for it. I want to work on being less triggered. So there’s topics that come up that I get triggered on and I don’t think I’m very different. I think everyone has their own little trigger things, whatever it might be. So what I’m working on now consciously is coming up with a trigger plan. So when I get triggered by this particular trigger, my default route is my the way my my neurons fire and the way my brain thinks whenever I live near the Grand Canyon, say vision like that’s the way the river is flowing in my head, like the patterns of thought are going that way. I want it to like shift and change course to go a different way. But it’s not easy to do. And it’s taken a lot of practice. So in 90 days from now, I want to be able to have said I’m making more progress on less reacting to certain common triggers that show up in my marriage and in my life, because I’ve consciously practice thinking a better ways around those things.
Lantz Howard 49:42
And that is, I mean, that’s a whole nother that’s a new podcast episode. Thanks. We all have triggers. We all have some Oh, yeah, we sure do that. React about you know, we tell our children like hey, just count to 10 it’s like, let’s take our own advice. Right to breathe Paros, but I mean, you’re talking about mindset, you know. And then there are pathways of growth. So thank you for sharing that. Any last encouragement for men who are pursuing to be champions who are pursuing courage, wholehearted living in the context of sexual intimacy with their marriage,
Dan Purcell 50:23
I would say, embrace your sexuality for what it is, in all the good that it is. And we talk about like you mentioned earlier, there’s so much emphasis on emotional connection first before sexual connection, which I believe is perfectly valid. But just as valid as that is sexual connection can also proceed emotional connection. So don’t apologize for wanting to be sexual. Because that’s the way God built you. And that’s a beautiful and wonderful way you can connect with the with the amazing person in your life who’s gone through years of growth with you, then through the ups and downs, it’s you and hold her close and look her in the eye and just love her in that way. Cool.
Lantz Howard 51:09
Well, thank you so much for today.